Canada’s opposition look like fools re pension reform issue

Apart from the Sun News Network, it has gotten to the point that I can’t turn on a TV news or politics show, because when I do, all I see and hear are NDP MPs and Liberal leader Bob Rae and most of his Liberal caucus frothing at the mouth. If they had justification to be so angry, it wouldn’t be a problem. But, the way they are behaving is actually embarrassing, particularly since they truly seem to think they have finally found the Conservative hidden agenda. 

Meaning, this whole high dungeon is nothing more than pure spin. For example, I saw Ralph Goodale turn around and say something to Rae, which looked like very much like he was congratulating him. And all the time Rae was ranting, Liberal MPs David McGuinty and Scott Brison were leaning to their left to get into the TV shot. Sad, really sad.

But, speaking of Bob Rae, isn’t he the same leader who put Ontario deeply into deficit in the early 1990s when he raised entitlements (welfare rates) so high he took away all incentive for people to work? The Harris PC government lowered those rates by 21% early in their mandate over the summer of 1995 and within a few years, 100,000 people were working again and no longer on social assistance.

Anyway, Bob Rae and the Harper hating media, are making absolute fools of themselves. I heard Prime Minister Harper’s speech in Davos live and I heard him clearly say that the CPP (Canada Pension Plan), which is funded by workers’ contributions, was in good shape for the long-term and that no one who was receiving the OAS (Old Age Security), which comes out of taxation and general revenues, now or in the near future would be affected by pension reform.

So, what part of that do people not understand?  Maybe part of the problem is that I watched the PM speech on SNN and, as such, was able to clearly hear ALL of the PMs speech. However, from what I have read on other blogs, that was not the case with other networks. 

One way or another, OAS is going to have to be reformed. But, it is going to have to be done carefully. We only have to look to Greece, Italy and Portugal to know the consequences of having entitlements that a government cannot fund.

The crux of the matter is that pension reform is not for the immediate future. It is for the long-term.

Sheesh!

33 thoughts on “Canada’s opposition look like fools re pension reform issue

  1. How bizarre, how bizarre, Sandy especially as Libby Davies #2 in the NDPQ-F party has put a private members bill on the agenda 6 or is it 7 times.
    Libby wants new Canadians to get a pension when the have never lived, worked or paid one penny into it.
    So far it has been voted down.
    Bob Rae seconded Ruby Dahlias attempt to get a pension for immigrants after 3 years, bill C428.
    Can you imagine how that would have drained the well?
    What hypocrites the Dippers and Liberals are.
    Of course our ever alert Media will call them on their blatant hypocrisy and vote buying……right? ………..waiting……..only crickets.

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    • Bubba — I swear the progressives and liberals in this country have lost all credibility. I just heard an exchange on David Akin by Diane Finlay. She said the NDP voted against income splitting for seniors and increasing the GIS. Hypocrites the lot of them.

      Re most of the media — crickets is right. Imagine if the shoe were on the other foot.

      I am convinced that whatever the Conservative gov’t does, it will improve things for retirees over the long term.

      Another insight — this hysteria reminds me of the prorogation affair. We know how much difference that made in the full scheme of things. The opposition just don’t learn. They keep on crying wolf. Now, they are trying to scare seniors too boot.

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  2. Just got back from the big city so missed QP today. We had a great lunch at the casino, and if anyone will suffer if there are changes to OAS of GIS it will be that casino. Never saw so many grey haired oldies in one place putting in their money and spinning.
    Also lots of them having lunch. They are not suffering. Those that could would be when one spouse dies and it cancels 1/2 of their income. But they get survivor benefits from said spouses CPP.

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  3. Hopeless, just hopeless is all I can think of to describe the pathetic NDP and Liberals with
    the media along for the ride on their ship of fools. They can all sink together, their behaviour simply won’t gain them the support or respect of the people of this country.

    Listening to a snippet of NDP leadership candidate Nathan Cullen bragging how he’s against the pipeline, yakking about Harper cutting OAS which is a damned lie and lamenting the fact Harper is PM with only 40% of the vote was a good insight into why that lot can never get anywhere near power or we’re caput as a viable nation.

    Bob Rae and the Liberal rump have nothing to offer either, Rae is concentrating on grabbing the leadership, trying desperately to look and sound important and failing badly.
    One thing we do know, Rae is not a person we’d want steering us through this economic uncertainty. No matter who leads the NDP, their illogical ideology would put us right out of business in short order.

    Let’s say when it comes to opposition we are being badly served and thank God we have a solid majority with a PM who is most capable and best we’ve had in memory.

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  4. They have proved to be blatant liars and I have nothing but contempt for these idiots. I listened to what the PM actually said which has nothing in common with the NDP/Liberal claims with the support of the consensus media.

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  5. Heads you lose, tails you lose.

    If the Prime Minister did not make any reference to pension reform, how long before someong did the math and accused him of being financially irresponsible and putting us into the same dangerous situation as Greece and the EU nations face?

    May as well ignore the nay sayers and carry on with the important work. BTW, this might be a great tactical ploy by the PM; OAS reform will probably be phased in over several years, but while the gnashing and wailing goes on, the government is quietly cutting 10% of the spending and laying off thousands of civil servents. No fuss, no muss….

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    • I agree Gerald. But the opposition will tell you that all of those other 4 parties are progressive/liberal. And, my reaction is always: so what? They are still different parties. Funny that the Chretien Liberals won by 40% and it was okay then.

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  6. Well Rae and most of the left over’s in the liberal party at their advanced age, I can understand how they would fear any talk of reforming old age security payments.
    What’s Bob at now? If he got the idea the government was going to make him wait an extra year or two for his “entitlement” the resulting high dugeon is expected.
    Or did you forget that when a liberal says canadian’s, they mean liberals.

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  7. Gerald @ 9:54 actual eligable voters in 2011 was 24,000,000 of that number 14,720,000 or 60% of that 24,000,000 actually voted.
    40% or 5,888,000 voted Conservative.
    30% or 4,416,000 voted NDPQ-F.
    19% or 2,796,000 voted Liberal.
    So of actual voters actually voting, can’t count you if you did not vote , can we?
    81% did not vote Liberal
    70% did not vote NDPQ-F
    60% did not vote Conservative It does not make much sense until you figure out that 40% of 14,720,000 is 58.8% of actual voters actually voting.
    So of actual votes cast by actual voters Conservatives got nearly 60% of the actual, real, living breathing vote.
    Seems to me if you stay home you don’t count, can’t be counted, and don’t care.
    Now for more fun with numbers what would Parliment look like if each MP had to have 50% +1 to win his or her seat?
    107 Tories
    36 NDPQ-F
    2 Liberals
    Bitter Bob won his seat with less than 50% Bye Bye Bobby
    The late Jack Layton got 20,000 votes in his riding 25,000 did not vote for him.
    Numbers from Elections Canada
    Cheers Bubba

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  8. Would it not be worth while for the Prime Minister to institute a once a month Television information program to tell Canadians exactly in an unfiltered speech what the Conservative Government has done and will be doing in the future.I am sure there are many Television stations who would be pleased to have the PM on every month.This would really ZAP the opposition and the MSM and really let Canadians that are not aware see what the Prime Minister is up against every day.It would let them hear what is the truth verses the lies and twisted headlines that they read and hear every day.That,s it from me for today.

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    • Bert — Having regular information programs sounds good in practice but this is exactly what started this whole issue with the OAS. The PM would make things worse because the opposition would parse each and every word he said. He can’t be specific about something a money issue because that will be in next month’s budget. However, I noticed that the media is getting tired of the pension matter. Wendy Mesley last night had the political panel talking about how government’s deal with bad news. That was at least helpful.

      Bob Rae just looks pitiful, however. As was watching the Liberals stuck in that small corner of the HOC. Canada needs two strong main parties but I can’t see how they are going to come back looking the world like screaming banshees. Click this space for the Google page on banshees: http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&cp=4&gs_id=a&xhr=t&q=banshee&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=bans&aq=0&aqi=g1g-s1g2&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=49b737aa4a490573&biw=1280&bih=522

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  9. Thanks Sandy, I did that number thingy after the last election when the usual suspects started blotivating about the election results.
    I have put a few people into stunned silence when I trot out the real numbers.
    I agree that the PM putting out a fireside chat would just give the off-center opposition some more sky-is-falling attempts at relevance.
    Anyone listening to what HM PM Harper actually said would know it’s all nonsense.
    I believe PM Harper opened the gate the opposition has rushed at the bait and will look like even worse losers when a sensible fair pension reform bill tabled as part of the budget is revealed.
    I am 63 retired at 60 took the hit and speaking to my MP about this he assured me that people in my position or about to retire would not be affected.
    I was assured of fair and equitable treatment, I have no reason not to have faith in what he said to me.
    I trust this Government, I trust My MP, they will do the best they can for us.
    I really think the louder the oppos’ howl the easier it will be for our strong majority Government to find ways of saving money by trimming the expense accounts of MP’s or CBC which has 730 people earning over 100,000 a year.
    Jack Layton and Oliva Chow had a combined expense account of over 1 million dollars.
    How many needy seniors would that give an extra 500$ to a month?
    That would be 2000 seniors lifted out of poverty.
    One has to wonder if Jack and Oliva ever slept, they billed over 3,000 a day in “expenses” 7 days a week 365 days of the year.
    Why isn’t third place, bitter Bob yelling about that.
    Most of the Media in this Country are absolutely disgraceful partisan LIARS!
    The good news is they weren’t believed last May and everytime they cry “Wolf” they turn off more and more people.

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  10. I worked in the private sector ( one company) for over 28 years; I do not have a pension, what I did have is a profit sharing plan which the company contributed in my name, if the company did not make any money in any one year all I got was 6%,if the company made money we would get a maximum of 18%. I listened to PMSH speech and he clearly stated that there would be no changes to CPP which is fundamentally sound; what may change is OAS and GIS these two programs are funded through general revenues which fluctuate up or down dependent on GDP the European Union and the United States have moved or are moving to increasing the age to collect OAS from 65 to 67 because of the economic situation in todays world. All this I understand, but what I do not get is the Liberal Party of Canada’s feigned indignation on the Conservatives attack on Seniors. Were was the indignation when this same party during the mid to late1990’s cut funding to health and infrarstructure and transfer payments. Where was the concern for seniors and Canadian

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  11. Only thing I have to say RE:fireside chat so to speak ,Is,how many Canadians really, are getting the truth from the TV,newspapers & radio.Even some people that I associate with and vote Conservative,say I DID NOT KNOW THAT at some of the remarks I make about new policy or whatever that the Government is contemplating or has done.They work and don,t watch Sun TV or listen to Lowell Green CFRA radio to get the true facts.They read a newspaper on the bus and get the Opposition view of everything that is bad with the Conservatives.There has got to be a better way to educate the Canadian people about what is really happening..And I would not poo poo the TV angle as PM Harper could give legitimate examples of when his words or policies have been twisted and lied about.Example the wafer episode..Anyhow,that is me again for today.

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  12. Will see guys.
    It is ridiculous that the resource richest country in the world cannot mantain the old population support, but I will not argue with you. It is useless.
    I hope on people to vote differently next time. I will. I am sorry I voted for Harper.
    Enjoy your life when you are young.

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    • Leo, you sound absolutely pitiful. Enjoy my life when I am young? Yes I did, thankyou.

      My point is — I already get the OAS and my husband is 64, just on the cusp of applying. Yet, we both know public pensions need to be reformed. My grandchildren and great-grandchildren (yes I have two younguns already) simply can’t afford to maintain the entire babyboom generation. It’s about fairness, as well as entitlements.

      So, you won’t vote for Harper again? If you think that the NDP and Liberals can do a better job than the Conservatives, go for it. As for me, Lord willing, I’ll vote for Harper again. Is the current gov’t perfect? Not by a long shot. But, if you want Canada to look like Greece, Italy, Spain or Portugal, vote the alternative. I don’t.

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    • By the way Leo — this whole fiasco is simply fear mongering by Bob Rae and the NDP. Nothing major is going to happen to your government pensions — unless you are still in your 40s. And, if you are, you will have plenty of time to prepare for any changes to age of eligibility or whatever.

      I just can’t believe people are being taken in by the media and the opposition. It is all conjecture.

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  13. Gee Leo all this is just another gotcha moment for the Opposition and their Lefty media supporters.
    Bob Rae is frantic and desperately trying to be relevant.
    Remember Attawapiskat?
    Well that was last week.
    Next week there will be another “Crisis”
    Another “Wafergate”
    We are enjoying good sensible, stable majority Government.
    Just take a look at Europe.
    The NDPQ-F and the Liberals want to shut down our Oil Sands.
    Now where do you suppose the money is going to come from?
    Both the NDPQ-F and the Liberals have tried to give away our OAP to people immigrating from the third world with only three years residency.
    Don’t take my word for it Google Bill c-248 or bill c-538.
    The Dipper deputy Libby has put a private members bill forward 6 or 7 times.
    Bob Rae seconded Ruby Dhalla’s private members bill to do the same thing.
    I don’t know how old you are Leo but if you think that would not destroy our OAP.
    Vote for them, just goggle those two bill numbers and if thats what you want help yourself.

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    • A beautiful saying Jen — I will have to remember that. Politicians like Bob Rae and Nycole Turmel look to the next election. Statesmen like Stephen Harper and Jim Flaherty look to the future.

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      • Doug — You just don’t seem to get it. Your comment had nothing to do with this post about the “opposition” so I did not approve it. Typical, no matter what I write, you twist your comment to be anti-Conservative government and/or anti-Harper. I am just so not interested.

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  14. If the opposition looks like fools, why are polls showing 75% of Canadians would rather have a tax increase than a pension delay? The Toronto Sun says Harper and Tories “In for a World of Hurt” if they pursue this line of policy.

    As the Quebec lady told Mulroney “good by Charlie Brown” if you even touch pensions now or in the future.

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    • Nice try Doug — but just as many commentators are saying Harper is brave and forward-thinking to look at reforming OAS. I would sure not want a tax increase in favour of an OAS delay. Since retirement at age 65 is no longer compulsory, many work till 67 or later. Mostly its unionized workers who still deal with an automatic retirement at 65.

      Up to 1970, when people died much earlier, the age of eligibility for OAS was 70 — and remember the CPP had just started at the point. Yet people survived. Now, people live much longer so the cost for OAS are that much higher and climbing.

      Good by Charlie Brown is of a time long past. And, in 2015, I am confident that when Canadians are faced with the stark choice of the Conservatives, who while far from perfect, do and will do a good job of managing the economy, versus a crazy off-the-wall NDP and a broken Liberal Party ……

      Oh, and by the way, you mentioned something in the comment that I didn’t approve about Jet Fighters and Jails. Get over it, the vast majority of Canadians actually do want Canada to be ready to fight our own battles and to be a leader in the world and to keep criminals off our streets.

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      • Jets will not be bought for several years so no money has been spent buying them, so where would the savings be. And, no one will tell me or others where all those new jails are being built. I have heard some are being renovated, where are the new ones, other than in some peoples mind.
        And when they do get built, they will keep criminals in jail so they can’t get out and murder again. Remember, the senator’s daughter was murdered by a repeat offender. Who let him out of jail in the first place, does that judge or lawyer or the bleeding hearts feel any remorse.

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    • For those who are interested, here is a Google page with why Harper is correct to reform the OAS. This theme is defective in that my links show as dark space. So, just click in the next space here.

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      • I’m going to be experimenting with some themes this afternoon. I just can’t fix the problem I have with links in comments disappearing. They are there but until someone moves their mouse over them, not visible. Frustrating because I really like this theme but visitors need to be able to see everything.

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  15. Voters do not vote on dollars or debts or deficits or employment numbers.

    Political Science 101, they vote on values and their sense of “which one of these people are on my side, which one can I trust to help me and my family.”

    When a politician says jets OK, prisons, OK warships OK medicare cutback pension cutback, they are sending a “values” message to voters. The Tories have been overwhelmed with emails saying “not now not ever” regarding OAS.

    Sandy you know teachers have been asked to shore up their own pensions 3X now. They are given a choice every time 1) cut payouts, 2) retire later 3) pay higher premiums. #3 wins every time and by a wide margin.

    Teachers are no different than other Canadians. When asked 1) cut OAS or 2) raise taxes 75% said #2.

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    • No one has ever asked me those questions Doug. You make huge assumptions.

      Right now teachers can retire over a fifteen year or longer period. Many retire sooner, others later depending on health and circumstances.

      I wouldn’t mind paying more taxes if they weren’t wasted on e-health and air ambulance scandals.

      I believe you are wrong about the jails and the jets. The values that most Canadians hold is pride in one’s country and safety and security in our communities. Jets are needed to help our troops when they are called upon. We know how bad the situation is with the helicopters, lives are at risk because of a political decision.

      Also, I hear a lot of complaints about slap on the wrist liberal justice. There is a regional jail in the Niagara area and I have never ever heard anyone say it should be torn down or not expanded. Yes, rehabilitation by all means, but punishment as well. It is called experiencing the consequences to ones actions, something progressives have a hard time with. My husband is on the board of an agency that helps offenders re-integrate into the community after their sentence is served. It is not like conservatives don’t care. We do. We just don’t forget about the victims and the crime that was committed in our quest to accommodate the perpetrators.

      To each his own opinion. But, one thing I have noticed is you really do believe the majority in this country think like you do. As the stats quoted early in this thread by Bubba Brown indicate, they don’t.

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